Suspicious voting behavior reporting thread

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#176 by beliar
2020-10-18 at 19:03
< report >The game has a trial out. it's not against the rules to vote based on the trial.
#177 by llee1000
2020-12-30 at 17:36
< report >link and link

Both accounts made today and share the same votes
#178 by ninius
2021-01-31 at 00:16
< report >u188026 has an insane amount of vns voted, idk if this can be a real account.
#179 by lexer
2021-02-03 at 21:19
< report >link
plus link and link to a lesser degree

are very similar and were all created in the last 2 weeks
#180 by tomekingjp
2021-02-05 at 16:19
< report >link
All had a hidden vote (probably from the same user as well) of 5 all on the same day.
#181 by mutsuki
2021-02-05 at 16:31
< report >how is that suspicious
there's someone with a hidden vote account who probably signed up on that day and put all their votes down at once
you can't see what else they voted on so it could be that they just thought all of the games for that developer were 5/10 and somewhere else they've given other votes to other vns.

if you want to see suspicious check out my votes. all of them are bad votes and probably should be banned lmao

reply to below: who said 5/10 was a mediocre score?
it's probably one of those '5/10 was average 7/10 was the best vn ever made and anything above that is never used' type of votersLast modified on 2021-02-05 at 17:26
#182 by tomekingjp
2021-02-05 at 16:45
< report >It's suspicious to me that the dude read a VN from the dev, gave it a mediocre score, decides to keep reading and repeats the same exact cycle for all of their works.

If you don't think that's suspicious then hey, good for you. I'm just here to give attention to the mods. They can view a hidden vote's accounts so they can be the final judge.

Reply to above because I guess we're really having a debate over a report:
I don't even know why you choose to argue that 5/10 isn't average but mediocre because that's not even what my main point is.
I'm talking about how all of his votes are 5. This makes me think he didn't read any of the games the same way someone just mass-votes 1 or 10s to mess with the dev, especially when all but one of their game have 1 vote total.Last modified on 2021-02-05 at 18:45
#183 by armony
2021-02-05 at 18:47
< report >@tomekingjp
Yup, that 5/10 voter is suspicious as hell. When I was looking through my visual novel list I noticed that there's a lot "5/10 hidden" votes on many vns I voted on in the last few months. The thing is, most of those games are super-obscure VNs from Freem that I added to the database myself, plus I refuse to believe that anyone sane would give 5/10 to this kusoge: link
#184 by eacil
2021-02-05 at 22:40
< report >Wow, that answers my question because I also saw 5/10 on all Hard's games and I can tell you we are not talking about the most well known developer here. I even thought we had a new oldies lover too shy to show himself.
#185 by leulight
2021-02-13 at 16:39
< report >link

All of these have the same entry as 1s and were created on the same day.
#186 by llee1000
2021-02-15 at 20:26
< report >link

Considering the five reviews that were posted and promptly deleted, well... I think that speaks for itself.
#187 by beliar
2021-02-15 at 20:28
< report >Yorhel has already banned him, and I added his votes to the ignore list for a good measure. It's clear that he's just trolling at this point...
#188 by abyssaleros
2021-02-18 at 16:11
< report >I am curious.
I just noted that someone with a hidden tag voted both of our games (Society of Lust) with a rating of 1 today. However, it seems his voting is ignored on the bayesian rating score.
Why can someone who is obviously trolling still vote?
#189 by yorhel
2021-02-18 at 16:17
< report >If the vote shows up on the VN page, the user isn't on the ignore list yet. The bayesian rating is only updated once a day so it's just lagging behind.

...and when is someone an "obvious troll"? aren't people allowed to have opinions anymore? :/
#190 by abyssaleros
2021-02-18 at 16:18
< report >I doubt he read even one and if he did read one and it was that worse, why reading the other one.
And I am sure that the rules for a 1 have not changed since I am not active here anymore, Yorhel.
#191 by yorhel
2021-02-18 at 16:22
< report >We never had a rule against 1 votes. We did have a warning at some point, but it's never resulted in an enforcement action. t10302.1 is pretty clear about it.

I mean, I understand that policy sucks, but enforcing purely based on voting patterns is such a damn slippery slope.
#192 by mrkew
2021-02-18 at 16:23
< report >You mean these rules
These are the only ways to get on that list:
1. Vote on unreleased games (not even a trial available).
2. Openly admit to voting in a certain way just to screw the stats.
3. Use multiple accounts to vote.
I don't see how someone voting on your game breaks anything. People vote based on all kinds of things, including some "readers" who vote after skimming through the CG rip.
#193 by abyssaleros
2021-02-18 at 16:27
< report >I am sure there were once some notes that explained when and how 1 and 10 should be given.
P.S. I just saw that yorhel wrote, that these notes were deleted.
#194 by abyssaleros
2021-02-18 at 16:32
< report >Thanks, Yorhel for answering.
Seems my standards for voting are still higher than that of the average user here. Not regretting, having "retired" from this community.
#195 by mrkew
2021-02-25 at 17:17
< report >u191284
I wouldn't say anything, but his reviews keep popping up in the new reviews. It's quite annoying.
#196 by beliar
2021-02-25 at 17:24
< report >The thing is, it's most likely not the dev himself. He has encouraged his fans on the Discord to show the appreciation by voting on vndb, which I suppose they are doing. Yorhel took a look when you first reported the issue, and only a few accounts seems to be duplicates. And we can do little to prevent shilling...
#197 by yorhel
2021-02-25 at 17:30
< report >I'm actually inclined to add shilling as a reason to put users on the ignore list. People who only vote on entries when they're told to add negative value to the overall voting system (i.e. they introduce a huge bias). Problem is, we can't always reliably detect when this is the case and I'm not entirely sure what we should do with the reviews.

(Edit: where does the "shilling" term even come from? I don't see anyone else use it in this context)Last modified on 2021-02-25 at 17:34
#198 by mrkew
2021-02-25 at 17:37
< report >link but if you ask me the origin I wouldn't know myself.
#199 by beliar
2021-02-25 at 17:37
< report >The thing is, shilling is only obvious, when it is so blatant as it is here. I assume most of such cases pass by undetected, and it's mostly the reviews that made it obvious. You cannot really put every user with only one or two votes on an ignore list. Though, I suppose such obvious situations could be dealt with...

That said, I'm also not sure what to do about the reviews. They clearly do not represent the VN correctly, with each shill calling it a masterpiece, thus I'm inclined to flag them, but that way lies a slippery slope.

Edit: where does the "shilling" term even come from? I don't see anyone else use it in this context
Wiktionary sheds some light on that.Last modified on 2021-02-25 at 17:39
#200 by mutsuki
2021-02-25 at 18:22
< report >While we're talking about that I kinda found the votes on Aquadine kinda fishy. If these are people who don't know how to vote properly they'd just give 10/10 to it, but why are there so many 9/10s specifically?
It's probably just a co-incidence but the 2 9/10 reviews also don't help.