Ever 17 GD

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#1 by usasoldiern
2011-02-24 at 23:25
< report >I'm kind of surprised there isn't a general discussion for this game, so I took the liberty of creating one. Understand that I haven't finished Ever 17 as of yet, so obviously my thoughts and, thus opinion, are very much incomplete. Since I didn't want to run the risk of running across any spoilers, I decided to create this so I can make some comments on a route by route basis.

I've played a good portion of the Tsugumi route in Ever 17 and, to be honest, I'm not sure if I like the game or not. I find the characters rather bland and the only thing to really have interested me so far is the awesomely trippy prologue The switching of point of views constantly from Takeshi to the Kid was brilliant but certain things in the Tsugumi route such as Swimming through a passage, possibly risking freezing or drowning, to save a freakiong hamster? really? Well, at least Tsugumi herself thought the idea was ridiculous.

Of course, there are still some interesting things such as the kid's amnesia and the fact he may be insane, what exactly Tsugumi is up to, etc that assure that I won't give up on this game probably at all. But, I just wanted to give a progress report. And, yes, I do hope I end up eating my words by the time all is said and done.
#2 by moogy
2011-02-24 at 23:48
< report >ever17 sucks dont play it
#3 by saberger
2011-02-25 at 00:09
< report >How's true!
#4 by then00bavenger
2011-02-25 at 00:23
< report >link

use that patch before you play, imo
#5 by usasoldiern
2011-02-25 at 00:27
< report >@ 4

You know I was thinking the translation had quite a few errors. Can I continue from where I'm at with this patch?
#6 by then00bavenger
2011-02-25 at 00:46
< report >I would assume so.

The important thing is that the translator is so retarded that he managed to actually spoil the game because of one of his mistranslations. The patch fixes that.

And he has a weird habit of translating ううん as yes but the one who made that patch was just fixing up typos and stuff so that kind of crap was untouchedLast modified on 2011-02-25 at 00:47
#7 by usasoldiern
2011-02-25 at 08:32
< report >So after finishing Tsugumi's route my opinion has changed for the better. the games take on immortality was really interesting and Tsugumi had some great scenes such as her crushing her hamster .

In any case I decided to go the You route this time because I wanted to see the story from Kid's point of view and and the replacement of Coco with Sara kind of caught me off guard, though I like the less annoying voice . But, I haven't even finished the first day of the You route so I can't really comment much more. But, it seems my hopes for the Kid/Takeshi storylines to fill in each others gaps may not come true though I am interested in the fact that I know I heard Coco's voice when Kid and You found Sara in the elevator.
#8 by hayate135
2011-02-25 at 13:05
< report >You's route is somewhat similar to the Question Arcs of the Higurashi series, in that it introduces a sense of mystery to the overall plot. I happened to play through her route first, and so I basically started off the entire game with more questions than answers. Hope you enjoy!

BTW, does anyone have a recommended route order for the game? I see that you can start and finish with whichever you like with the four initial routes, but I was wondering if anyone had a route order they thought that had the best flow. I ended up going by the order of character portraits they had lined up that you can choose to accompany a save file (You > Tsugumi > Sora > Sara > Coco). And, as previously mentioned, starting with You's may have raised eyebrows a little too early (And I think this is the route that had the fatal spoiler-ific mistranslation on the translators part that TNA was talking about? I'm not sure exactly where it was).Last modified on 2011-02-25 at 13:21
#9 by usasoldiern
2011-02-25 at 19:55
< report >I'm planning on scrambling the order. That is after finishing You's route I'll go to Sora's and finally Sara's but going by your order there is really only a difference between our first and second routes. So, I'm kind of curious about the route order as well.
#10 by usasoldiern
2011-02-26 at 09:14
< report >So, I finished You's and I enjoyed it much more than Tsugumi's route, overall. It was very confusing since it introduced concepts such as time travel, the third eye, whatever the hell coco is susposed to be, and numerous scientific explanations . Truth be told, I know alot of the stuff covered went completely over my head, which (I hope) was the intention.

I was surprised that the kid and You got a happy ending, I was surprised after how the Tsugumi/Takeshi route went and I was also interested in how certain scenes such as the Coco carving scene inter lapped with the previous route I played which makes it clear to me that the events are very similar from route to route it's just that Coco,Sara, and a few other things changed the outcome.

Also, going by a little bit of the dialogue, as well as appearances, would I be wrong in thinking that You's mother was her future self?.

In any case, I guess I'll be starting Sora's route next.
#11 by emjay
2011-02-27 at 09:12
< report >Thats one thing I liked a lot about this visual novel. It kept me on the lookout for subtle hints and kept me theorizing on what exactly is going on as I progressed through the story.

On a level of emotional impact, Sora's route probably hit me the hardest. Hoping you'll enjoy it as much as I did
#12 by usasoldiern
2011-02-27 at 19:11
< report >So, after finishing Sora and Sara's routes I'm pretty much hooked. Ever 17's ability to surprise me with Sara turning out to be Kid's sister, which was foreshadowed a great deal in the prologue the more I think about it. and, as far as romance, I think that Sora, who I was initially the least interested in, was probably the most effective one .

Overall, I guess the route I enjoyed the most was Sara's though as it answered more questions than the previous routes. I guess I'll be going for the bad ends and, then finally, the Coco route.
#13 by emjay
2011-02-27 at 21:26
< report >You might want to archive You's bad end last before you hit up Coco's path it does a great deal of foreshadowing.

By the way, Coco's path is at least twice as long as your regular route, so expect to take a few breaks here and there if you plan on downing it in one sitting
#14 by usasoldiern
2011-02-27 at 21:49
< report >Ironically, I actually did You's ending last before reading your message emjay. And, I'm actually glad to hear it's twice as long because, frankly, that's what I was hoping.

The one thing I wonder is..does playing as Takeshi or the Kid make a difference?
#15 by emjay
2011-02-27 at 22:25
< report >You get to go on Coco's path by playing either protagonist as there are new choices available to you. I think it's better to play as the Kid though, as the revelation seems more fitting when it's with him. Either way, it goes off brilliantly and you won't really have to worry about which protagonist you want to play as if it's a matter of preference... you'll see why.

With that said, on a side note, which protagonist do you like better so far? My personal preference is Takeshi. Despite his typical goofy, impetuous, do-things-first-think-later approach, I liked that he takes a self-sacrificing initiative for his loved ones as evident in Tsugumi and Sora's epilogue. That's another thing I enjoyed in Ever17; the contrasting and difference between the two protagonist's thoughts and actions.
#16 by usasoldiern
2011-02-27 at 23:29
< report >Honestly, from a story line point of view I prefer the Kid. But, from a character point of view? Yeah, I'll go with Takeshi. Like you pointed out he seems to be the more likable of the two.
#17 by hayate135
2011-02-28 at 04:54
< report >This comment is directed towards those who finished the entire game, so don't read if you haven't finished yet.

After playing a couple routes out of a nostalgic whim, I've picked up things I haven't noticed during my first playthrough, now that I'm fully aware of the game's secrets this time around. Such as Takeshi's dark blue hair visible in Tsugumi/Sora's bad end. I briefly took note of it during my initial playthrough, but I dismissed it as an inconsistency on the artist's part or something to do with the lighting. The other thing I noticed was encountering Tsugumi, while playing as the Kid, staring at that one Octopus attraction (I forgot the name). I realized that that was a heartwrenching-moment in disguise, now that I know that she was actually reminiscing of the past, about the time she and Takeshi spent in there.Last modified on 2011-02-28 at 04:58
#18 by usasoldiern
2011-03-01 at 04:51
< report >After finishing Ever 17(jesus christ the Coco route was long, which it had to be) all I can think right now is that the amount of attention to detail and thought put into the story over the different routes and how they come to together so brilliantly is ridiculous.

Sure, I had a few problems with the game over all but..it's hard to fault something that had so much effort obviously put into it. I'm in between a 9 or 10, I'm just not sure yet.

I mean the amount of scenes and plot twist that made go "OH Shit!" is ridiculous such as the realization that the Kid looked nothing like the person the game led you to believe or The fact that Tsugumi is Sara and the Kid's mother or, my personal favorite, the fact that the Takeshi/kid routes were actually separate timelines instead of alternate dimensions like I thought and the fact that the Takeshi/Kid from both timelines was the same person all of this was ridiculously clever and made great use of the Visual Novel medium.

That's all I've got right now as I'm still basking in the awesomeness of Ever 17 and wondering..What do I read now?
#19 by hayate135
2011-03-01 at 07:25
< report >Glad to see you enjoyed the game as much as I did. After replaying most of the game, I really liked how, as I previously mentioned, some of the "OMG OH SHI-" plot elements were actually playing off right in front of our eyes during the pre-Coco routes. And it was all so magnificently subtle as we wouldn't even realize it until all would be revealed in Coco's route. Such as Takeshi's blue hair in the Tsugumi/Sora bad end, Hokuto's dark blonde hair in You's good end instead of the pale platinum that "the Kid" sports, the casually issued date of You's mother's death which occurred in 2019 I believe (and the reader was told all of this was happening in 2017), the inconsistency of You's full name, and how Tsugumi was incredibly suspicious of the cast in the Kid's routes (which is now understandable as she was basically thrust into a replica of the events 17 years ago) while she wasn't in Takeshi's, in which she was just another one of the survivors. So much I'd like to discuss on this masterpiece, but I'll save you guys the trouble. Anyways, If you want to squeeze more out of the Ever17 canon, you can read up on the drama CD translations posted here. They take place post-True end and follow some trials and tribulations of the cast following the 2034 incident.

As for other visual novels... IMO it'll be hard to find something mindblowing for you anytime soon after experiencing both Sharin and ever17 back-to-back, which obviously set the bar pretty high. There's always the Sharin FD, and coming up in the near future, the translation for the excellent Muv-Luv Alternative should be out.Last modified on 2011-03-01 at 08:00
#20 by usasoldiern
2011-03-01 at 08:22
< report >Yeah, I'll probably pick up Remember 11. I just want to check out more of this series and, no, I'm not expecting lightning to strike twice.
#21 by kiru
2011-03-01 at 11:51
< report >@19: You should always say that the drama cd's are terrible if you talk about them. The only reason you might want to get them is basically if you like listening to Sara or something.
Production values aren't really high, it sounds at times just totally awkward, definitely not a naturally flowing dialogue. And the worst part: It kicks the reason why e17 is good in the face. Hard. Yeah yeah, I know BW was cool and all, but how about the surprisingly good logic behind the true route and the events? At least one of those cd's says "screw it" and uses BW to be cool. Logical approach? Who needs that. Fortunately the other drama cd was just boring and stupid in a normal way.
#22 by gorgils
2011-10-20 at 09:13
< report >A few days ago I finally finished Ever17 after reading it 19 hours continuously. 12/12 Endings completed.

First of all I`d like to say that I had really underestimated this VN, it`s well written and it`s good. I honestly found very painful to get hooked to it. I tried many times. In fact after I reached the first good ending (Tsugumi), I ended up dropping this after I realized I had to skip through the whole thing from the beginning.

I hated a lot of stuff about E17.
- It is really slow in the beginning and you have to read for quite a few hours to get hooked.
- Too much skipping and too slow skip function. Wtf? More than 5 hours of my total time wasted on Ever17 was just skipping. Trololo~
- A lot of repeated scenes that had a few differences than the previous and you couldn`t just skip, else you would lose important information about the continuation.
- A lot of crappy routes (Sora and You). Especially Sora was retarded, lol.

Well, taking aside these `inconveniences`, the whole VN is totally worth to read, not only because it's a smart sci-fi story that is really well-written, but for the ending as well.

In my opinion it`s Epic beyond words. It succesfully trolls you and impresses you the same time.
It connects everything that has been shown this far and really well too. It has no plot holes.
Easily one of the best endings ever. I actually can`t think of any superior endings atm.

But it`s not perfect. Why? For its trolling factor.
- Cure needs 5 years to adjust your body`s cells. But who cares? Takeshi is uber pro l33t protagonist, so he can turn immortal after just 30 mins.

- Wow, mechanical toy pet dogs are going to be epic in the year 2017. I mean, they`re so good that they can swim up and down 400 feet under the sea. Can`t say the same about emergency escape submarines though. But it can be explained, I mean dogs are natural swimmers.

- The biggest troll line in visual novel history: `Coco "I was looking for Pipi."` TROLOLOLO. The whole thing started because a little girl was looking for her mechanical toy pet dog (too bad she didn`t know that dogs are natural swimmers and it could escape anyway). All the time-loops(or peeks to "alternative universes" whatever ;p), all of these deaths, of all this suffering- BECAUSE A LITTLE GIRL WATNED TO FIND HER TOY.

^If you like trolls or you can successfuly erase these 3 things from your memory, E17 will leave you really satisfied.

I also have a different opinion about R11 now, which for some reason I ended up finishing before E17. Wtf, not only the characters but like 50% of its plot as well is a ripoff.
It`s from the same company and same writer but still.. copies too much, makes the reader feel somewhat cheated.
They improved the pacing a lot (for me it never got boring) and made it a little more angsty but everything else is worse.

My final rating: 9/10Last modified on 2011-10-20 at 12:58
#23 by kiru
2011-10-20 at 09:56
< report >@22:

Takeshi never became immortal. The whole diving thing was... well, simply unrealistic.
If you mean the healing of that sickness... you should read it again. Antibodies.
No idea what you mean about the dog. Or Coco. It sounds pretty much like you didn't understand some things though.

Also: 5 hours skipping... how the hell do you skip? The skip function is quick and stops automatically at unread story-parts. It takes a few minutes at most. For all routes combined mind you.
#24 by gorgils
2011-10-20 at 12:45
< report >@23

Takeshi never became immortal. The whole diving thing was... well, simply unrealistic.
Brick Winkel said that Takeshi survived 'miraculously', for a reason even he couldn't explain. I assumed that it was effects of Cure. Well, both cases are unrealistic no matter how you look at it.
^Weak attempt to fix plot-hole = troll.

If you mean the healing of that sickness... you should read it again. Antibodies.
Obviously I was't talking about the sickness.

No idea what you mean about the dog
Other than a badly expressed troll?
Well.. Coco's dog dived at ~400 feet, got the terabyte disc from takeshi's body. Then went to the surface to give it to You, then dived again back to ~400 feet and entered the facility. If a fucking mechanical pet dog could do that, why a submarine couldn't last more than a few minutes?
And please don't tell me crap that it didn't have enough fuel, I know that and

^ it's a really really bad explanation, yet they tried to make it not look like a plot hole.
So, troll.

Or Coco.
The reason Coco wasn't recsued is because she was "looking for Pipi" (her dog). The whole thing started because of that. It's a big irony if you take into consideration that this super OP dog could escape easily from the facility unlike anyone else.

It sounds pretty much like you didn't understand some things though.
To me it sounds pretty much like you had turned your brain off while you were reading it. And you obviously don't remember things well.

Also: 5 hours skipping... how the hell do you skip? The skip function is quick and stops automatically at unread story-parts. It takes a few minutes at most. For all routes combined mind you."
Yes, around 5 hours of skipping to unlock 12/12 endings. I don't know how you did it with less, but skipping wasn't fast for me.Last modified on 2011-10-20 at 15:31
#25 by emmanuelvr
2011-10-20 at 17:20
< report >I gotta say, you did something wrong with the skipping part. To get bad ends you don't need many options, there's the shortcut system at the main menu that speeds things up, and 5 hours skipping is just too much. I don't think I skipped more than 1 hour and I got all bad ends.

Also, the Takeshi thing is obviously a Cure effect. He already experienced it when he escaped from HIMMEL without waiting the twelve hours (I think it was 12) of decompression to save Sora and Tsugumi. We don't know exactly how it works, so it's pretty much a way too convenient plot device, but it is part of the story and presented before.

The sub's problem was that it was sinking, not the pressure. But yes, the robot dog thing is complete bullshit and was crazy as hell.

And stop using the word troll, goddamn.
Last modified on 2011-10-20 at 17:26