Now this is what a true masterpiece should be

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#26 by behappyeveryday
2020-08-20 at 18:57
< report >@1 I only finished Chiwa's route so far and just started Hiyori's and I already understand you, in terms of drama Chiwa's route is one of the best stories I've ever read already. I didn't know though that you can choose the playing order, lol. There is only one choice (with two parts) and it isn't obvious that it would lead to different routes. I guess Chiwa and Hiyori are available from the start, but Haru and Kuro are not?

Honestly though, after getting the ending I wasn't eager to continue right away and proceed with the other routes. There are multiple reasons for this like the fact that it left me fulfilled or that I feel that it would be unfair to abandon her (she'll love MC even in other routes because it isn't something that she developed in her route, but rather a long-lasting feeling), but the most important is probably the fact that there is not enough "heart-warming slice of life" moments in this game. I expected that it would be the same as with almost all nakiges - a very long common route to build characters and then not so long routes. But, surprisingly, here you enter the heroine's route after about 5-10 hours of story, moreover half of this isn't even a slice of life, but worldbuilding and some drama. Rather than the problem with "pacing" as @7 said, the problem here is that there is way more drama and sadness in the story than happy moments, at least the Chiwa's route was like this. Rather than typical nakiges like vns from Key or Hoshizora (the only game I've read from Favorite), Sakura Moyu feels more like Fata Morgana with how depressing it through most of the story and how it doesn't give you a "quick release" from suffering, but slowly tortures you before that, revealing the puzzle of the story step-by-step.

@11 Honestly though, I would prefer a longer common route. Not as long as in other nakiges (I didn't read Irotodori yet), but at least twice as long as it was. I liked MC's initial interactions with Chiwa (hate/love relationship is my favorite), but there was barely any teasing after the first introduction. The same could be said about his other childhood friends - I like their interactions, but I would say that there are only about 3 hours of it before the routes branch.

By the way, after starting reading the Hiyori's route there is something that bothers me. I'm just at the beginning of the route and here we are introduced to the story of Tooya and an old lady. The old lady is supposed to be a mother of a "fake father of Chiwa", but timelines don't exactly match. The old lady is 90+ years old, but the fake father was rather young when he "accepted his role" ten years prior, moreover, he knew about the origin of his name at this time, I don't remember though what he said about his mother's condition in Chiwa's route, but it seems she already wasn't alright back then. I can only assume that she gave birth to him when she was in her forties or even fifties, but it still feels somehow off. Moreover, him having a 10-year-old daughter is strange, considering that he should have take care of Chiwa in the last 10 years.

There is also something I want to ask those who completed the game.
Does this game, in the true end, makes all alternative routes a part of the whole story like in many top vns (Baldr Sky 2, Clannad, Ever17, etc) or they are just "what if" scenarios unrelated to it? It kind of hurts me that Chiwa's crush on MC would be unrequited in all other routes, though I guess she isn't the only one who loves him (Haru and Kuro seem to like him too, Hiyori only loves food), lol. It also bothers me that her route has the problems that could be only solved by MC and if left unattended they wouldn't disappear, like the inconsistency between timelines that'll lead to everyone forgetting her. If no one forgets her in other endings then it should have some sort of explanation.Last modified on 2020-08-20 at 19:00
#27 by diabloryuzaki
2020-08-20 at 19:28
< report >@26 any route than haru is just "another story" if we think about prologue at true end but every route before true end will lead mc to true end in the end. and it is not recommended to ignore or skip one of three heroines if you want to read true route for the truth about this vn setting because that three heroines is important presume to understand true end. you can try to ignore it but it will not give good effect to you especially for haru route
#28 by behappyeveryday
2020-08-21 at 02:51
< report >@27 I didn't plan to skip any routes in the first place, I just wanted to know if they are incorporated in the story as a whole (like in Baldr Sky 2 where each route is considered as something that happened in a real alternate dimension and MC then remembers what happened in each route or just "what if" scenarios. Based on what you said how "every route will lead MC to true end" it is the same here, so I'm relieved. I hate it when alternate routes aren't considered as a part of canon timeline like in G-Senjou no Maou where routes even driectly contradict to true end.
#29 by diabloryuzaki
2020-08-21 at 04:08
< report >@28 but sadly maybe you will have headache when read true end (like me) because it is very hard to read it and try to search relation between 3 previous route and true end will be "long journey" for you. it is recommended to not stop to read in the middle way, at least try to stop when it touch a part where it is no problem to stop to make you sorting information from it easily
#30 by behappyeveryday
2020-08-22 at 04:14
< report >Ugh, I barely can force myself to continue Hiyori's route. The fact that she considered sacrificing MC against his will to revive someone only she cared about makes her trash of a person. Her sacrificing herself instead doesn't excuse it (it should have been her only choice from the start), the fact that she even considered this as an option made me lose any affection towards her. Moreover, considering that "creatures of the night" already stopped "stealing people" for 65 years or so, and that the art family already was under Nacht's thumb from back then makes her backstory nonsensical (maybe it is explained later, but I doubt it). Nacht mentioned that he is the only one "creature of the night" left in the city and he definitely didn't kidnap Hiyori's sister, unless all of those events happened many years before and a part of her past life or something. Should I just skip it?
upd. Nevermind, I already checked summary, those weren't Hiyori's memories (I should have a guess as much), but her mother's - it still doesn't make sense timing-wise in either case, lol. Anyway, I skipped the rest of the route and have no regrets. Anyway, I don't like Hiroyri and her mother as they both are ready to sacrifice other people to achieve their happiness. I'd rather proceed with better heroines/routes.
Last modified on 2020-08-22 at 06:59
#31 by diabloryuzaki
2020-08-22 at 10:07
< report >#30 now i wait your reaction after read haru route and prologue from true end, trust me hiyori still feel easy to understanding
#32 by snowwhite
2020-08-23 at 04:19
< report >I just finished this Visual Novel. I was a little confused because it seemed very complex, with a lot of build up, but I managed to understand at least the basics of the story and having come here to see some more things helped a lot. Thanks for the discussion.

I scored an 8.2 and would probably be a 9 if the focus on True Route was entirely for Mashiro, I loved the character. Sad. To be honest, I don't really like Kuro, but I respect her route.

I'm in love with some soundtracks, what a beautiful work.
#33 by behappyeveryday
2020-08-24 at 01:56
< report >@31 It has nothing to do with "easiness to understand", I didn't have a problem in understanding anything so far, I wrongly assumed before reading the rest of the story. I just hated her personality, lol.Last modified on 2020-08-24 at 01:59
#34 by behappyeveryday
2020-08-25 at 08:37
< report >Here was some rant about Haru's route ending, but I decided to reconfirm if I missed something and if everything was justified, lol.
Yeah, it seems I mistranslated this phrase initially “条件代償”を破れば、俺の未来から死の運命は削除されない。更にハル自身も、削除しようとした死の運命を背負い込んでしまう。And so I assumed that in D-dimension Haru and MC wouldn't die because nightmare disappeared. Then again, I don't know why he was so sure that it is how things work, I guess it is just a piece of lazy writing right here. It would be so much better if the author just ended her route here instead of adding this unnecessary condition that "breaking the magic means that they both are destined to die" - I mean, how the hell does this work? The author just added it to force more drama, as if there weren't enough. Moreover, this MC we follow wouldn't get his happy end, never. It would be his alternate version (even if he kind of got his memories back, though it wasn't properly explained how the final bullet worked). In the end in Haru's route original Haru dies and original MC is forced to solitude through his whole life. And this is all Haru's fault for being unable to enjoy that she already has.Last modified on 2020-08-25 at 15:22
#35 by mdzz
2020-08-25 at 15:03
< report >^34

Sacrifice is like the major theme of the work. The universe mechanics get unveiled in the true, which may elucidate your questions.
#36 by behappyeveryday
2020-08-25 at 15:34
< report >@35 Rather than a "question" it is just my frustration over the fact that the nightmare's existence is meaningless. What is the point of it if Haru is going to die either way? Also, his first "bullet" was wasted - why did he just commit suicide immediately after Haru's second death? If he talked both to Asahi and Kuro in B timeline then he wouldn't waste another three bullets in a meaningless way, he could just shot Haru the next time, or the author could at least make them actually fight the nightmare with imagination instead of losing one-sidedly. Anyway, I loved the route, the most emotional moment to me was "ojisan's death", this is a 10/10 moment. But the way everything was handled in the end could be more well-thought-out and impactful than it was.

By the way, it seems that Haru's mother is the granddaughter of the old woman from Hiyuri's route, that same "friend of Tooya" they helped. It means that Chiwa is Haru's aunt. xD I wonder if a "new Haru" would be born in the world of Haru's ending and then they'll incedentally encounter each other and it'll lead to destruction of the universe.
Last modified on 2020-08-25 at 15:36
#37 by diabloryuzaki
2020-08-25 at 19:45
< report >#36
well that is how this vn work, when you think it should stop in here but author keep said to you to solve "which came first: the chicken or the egg" in his work. moreover the developer is Favorite where "sometime" they add unnecessary scene or "add too much scene"

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