|#1 by nightwish2|
2019-08-31 at 03:02
|I've seen people complain about the end of Maya's route. |
I agree and disagree.
It was poorly executed and rushed. But the MC had the right idea. He realized she wanted to go back to acting after she suppressed her fear. The reason for her fear was, after all, a situation that would never repeat itself, considering her friends and friends in the present. His "sacrifice" makes sense in this context because it shows he puts her future before his interests. She was clearly scared and clinging to him. Maya was acting like the MC did in Yukino's route. The relationship. The problems are>
- The MC was never this perceptive. He is a potato when it comes to other people's feelings. It felt forced
- They executed it in a stupid way. They didn't make clear that Maya started to like acting again until the very ending. They make the reader think the MC is just saying that for some stupid reason since we see no evidence until the very end when she admits she wants it.
|#2 by phantomjs|
2019-08-31 at 03:29
|I dislike the end of her route a lot (or rather, the way the protagonist acted)|
We humans are arguably selfish by nature. The protagonist acted pretty selfless at the end of her route. I find it very unbelievable, however, as most human beings (in my opinion) will react in a very selfish / possessive way and Maya was totally willing and wanted to stay with the MC. He also showed little sign of such selflessness prior to the ending. I totally agree that the ending wasn't handled well and ruin what was , I feel, the best route in the VN
Luckily, they fixed that in the append Maya IF route
|#3 by kotsukiko|
2019-09-02 at 09:43
|I'm going to put everything in a spoiler tag (...if I don't mess up my tags) since I talk about a lot of things quite late in her route; and yeah this turned out to be pretty long.|
The big problem with the end of her route is that it depends A LOT of your interpretation of the character, which is rather ambiguous; and even despite this still goes more towards the "the end makes no sense"side than the opposite if you're keeping in mind her character evolution in her route. And the whole deal about her mother but that's just how Japan is when it comes to family, I guess, no need for dev. when you are supposed to assume that being mature = assuming that your parents are right.
There's no question that Maya loved acting as a passion. but her route (particularly the tokyo part) also made it quite clear that she did it professionally for the people close to her, which is quite a different thing from doing big roles in movies because you want to be a country-renowned actor. This is made very explicit during her talk about why she started acting while they're looking for a cybercafe while going to Tokyo and her mindset when she started to do it- there was an heavy focus on how she liked to do it to make people CLOSE TO HER smile.
The real problem at the end is, in my opinion, not completely related to the MC's selflessness but rather the idea of forcing her when it wasn't clear that she really WANTED to do it at this particular scale (and since she was pretty much ready to do whatever he wanted to; to the point of allowing herself to faint just because of her desire to be needed by him, it was quite an irresponsible thing to do; even the MC is aware of the massive influence he has on her given some of his lines in the route IIRC). Acting doesn't have to mean big roles in movies; you can enjoy your passion very well without this. She wanted to act during her route because it made the people direcly close to her, in this case the committee, smile, first and foremost, something that is explicitly said many, many times, which is also a parallel to the reason she was acting when she was younger during her parent's divorce. She wasn't "just" scared of acting because of what happened; her motive for doing so weren't "that professional" so to say in the first place. It was similar to the MC's backstory of him doing this just to make other people happy in his youth as described by Yukino. It's not exactly the same as an "innate vocation"; just like stopping to run away from your past doesn't have to mean returning to how you were in your past.
She wanted to be NEEDED by people close to her; a point pressed both by herself and by Midori in some conversations when talking about her, which is also one of the very reasons her route exists in the first place. Not to mention the other very important point about wanting to prove herself FIRST by graduating as "Maya Tokizaki" to prove that she can exist as herself and as an individual (and not just by riding her past life and her past fame as "Misaki Maya", which is basically what the main ending is all about since it happens because of people recognizing her as such) and then, who knows, maybe start acting again, that's fanfic material since the routes don't go into post-HS much so who knows, which is completely forgotten.
A ton of her characterization is focused on her way of forcing through things in her own way (rules and laws be damned sometimes); which is pretty much the opposite of her ending.
The big problem isn't the protag's interest and him sacrificing himself in my opinion; I'd say that this side of him is more apparent and bothersome in some other routes, in this one it's just a lot more obvious because the ending was REALLY sudden but it could have worked and could have been in-character. It's the fact that Maya's ones are basically ignored, and that's why the biggest flaw of this end is that it happens absolutely out of nowhere; the baccura dvd was a poor trigger to "change everything in one single scene" compared to some of the "end triggers" in some other routes. Most of her route is basically about her loving acting, but also mostly caring about the ones close to her and doing using her skills to help them, not about her wanting everyone else seeing her performance in a large scale (hell, even the main reason she seriously acted in Baccura was because she thought it'd made her parents happier again when they were going to divorce, which was BEFORE her big trauma caused by the post-baccura impact in her career, and she calls herself stupid for believing that it'd work). This ED wants you to assume that acting has always been the ONE THING that was above everything else for her when a ton of her route is about her wanting to be recognized for something else than that and is pretty heavy on how it's just a single part of her, definitely not something that she should run away from, but also definitely not what should define her neither; in fact the ones doing that to her (mainly in the comment on the smartphone videos) are presented as terrible people most of the time.
Overall, the ending felt as a big non-sequitur after everything the player learns about her during the Toyko arc; which, to make things worse, was just before it. Acting has always been presented as a passion that she enjoyed but that was also a mean to an end somewhat, and it suddenly became the extreme opposite. For an ending like that to work it would have needed several more hours in her route (and even then how good it would be would be arguable since it'd massively change the character itself and her theme, and not necessarily in a good way; again there's the whole theme of "proving yourself" that would be an huge problem; but at least it'd make some kind of sense).
While the MC was extremely annoying at the end of Maya's route, he's not exactly the main problem; the sudden shift that throws a lot of the route and a hours and hours of charadev/characterization out the window was a lot more of a problem in my opinion. Some of these things aren't easily explainable just by saying that "she, in fact, like acting and is just scared" without dismissing huge chunks of the story and previous charadev. And even the intentions of the character herself.
I wouldn't even call the MC selfless personally; sure, it may be the "best thing to do" for her from a certain PoV (career-wise, etc, althouh this falls heavily into utilitarianism), but disregarding what someone (that is pretty much an adult) wants because you think that you know better; including knowing what the other person wants, seems pretty selfish to me. Or at the very least extremely arrogant. It's heavy infantilization.
The end does everything it can to change 15+ hours worth of "I'm doing it, because I like it AND because it makes you and the ones I love happy first and foremost, not for anyone else" (which isn't only because of her loving him, again, it was the same as a kid and it's one of the parts of her personality that is the complete opposite of Lion's)" into "It's her one and only passion and what her future should be about" in about 10 minutes just because the MC wanted more people to see her, which is ridiculous.
It sounds like the writer suddenly changed for the very last scene, or that they should make the story more "PC" (from a japanese PoV; accepting that your parents are right and important despite abuse, etc...) at the last minute.
Luckily the append exists and tackle a lot of things better even if it just scratches the surface (still a lot of wasted opportunities). Although her mother still get away scot-free in it but meh. Filial piety I guess.Last modified on 2019-09-02 at 10:11
|#4 by i7-8700k|
2020-01-12 at 15:07
|I'll put in some arguments.|
FIrst of all, Hoshioka is a uni prep school. Why is someone's mother who keeps nagging their daughter to get back to Acting sending her there? She could have picked a cheaper school if graduation is only the goal for her "pride".
Second, its pretty easy to get a part time job in this VN (learnt it from Kyou route). Maya could have started working as the ending.
It seems the author wanted Maya to return to acting from the very start, and the pillars established for a stable life without acting were completely dumped. In between when she told Yuuma that she wanted to be known for who she is, and not live on her past glories really touched me. That clear goal of hers is what ruined the ending for me.
The Append Scenario is really good, but it skims through the important events by briefly summarizing them. Maya and Chieri are buddies? They managed to let Maya get a scholarship by doing a "we want to graduate with Maya" campaign which convinced her mother? Seriously it seems that those events would have made a much better ending.
Also Yuuma could never set Maya straight. She wanted to be of use to all those around her, but she doesn't need to. Yuuma could have said that she can be as useless as she wants and he'd still accept her. White Album 2's ending triumphs in this regard.
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