Umineko EP5 Solutions !!HEAVY SPOILERS!!

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#51 by pendelhaven
2014-10-31 at 17:29
< report >@47: the howdunnits are pretty to solve once you know umineko's biggest secret which revolves on the whydunnit.

in a sense umineko trolled you into thinking that the howdunnit is important. cleverly covering the whydunnit part.
#52 by tomao2
2014-11-05 at 05:37
< report >I still don't like Gab's solution. I'd rather find some other reason for it.

What about the fact that Erika piece never saw Klause? His existence was a big point in the story and Erika even used his supposed existence to further her own ends but she was never shown seeing the man.

Did the detective authority protect her from the illusion of the grandfather but fail on Yasu? She also has good enough vision that it's written in red that she can keep watch over a staircase for hours at a time and be able to notice if anyone went past her.

Also wondering if the fact that the entire thing was a replay, Battler just came in at the moment of the killer revelation, might have something to do with it?

Perhaps it was something Bern inflicted on her piece to begin with? We are shown that the witches can block out red truths like Klause's death, in order to heighten drama.Last modified on 2014-11-05 at 06:03
#53 by tomao2
2015-01-06 at 06:15
< report >So... Scanlations of episode 8 Umineko manga came out and I was rather shocked to see Erica state, flat out, exactly what Gab said. It really was Battler's perspective. Kanon was never in the room during the first meeting. It wasn't a red truth but I had no idea that this bit was actually addressed in the story.

So, Erica has the detective authority to bring all people into the room... but she didn't use it. Just like she didn't use it to make sure the bodies were dead. It even actually described how the murder took place. Which shocked me cause I wasn't aware of that.

I guess I'm just posting to say I was wrong and sorry for the arguing. Although, it would have been nice to know that Erica admitted that's how it went, even if she didn't say it in red.

I really glad there was a lampshade hanging on that particular point, in story. It was my biggest gripe.Last modified on 2015-01-06 at 06:18
#54 by karifean
2015-09-24 at 00:19
< report >Just chiming in to give my own impression of that part. Erika did, in fact, use the Detective's Authority and gathered everyone. As we all know, everyone was there. However, you need to separate the meta way of looking at the situation, and the in-gameboard way of looking at the situation.

From the meta perspective, Erika can make her own piece use the Detective's Authority. With this, she has the guarantee that her piece did, in fact, just gather everyone.

However from the ingameboard perspective, this isn't a game, it's "reality". Piece Erika may be a bit delusional but not delusional enough to think she has superpowers of gathering everyone. The fact that she does have them thanks to the meta is something Piece Erika could not possibly know. So from HER perspective - which doesn't include Kanon or Shannon, either one of them - there are no contradictions. Because she wouldn't know that her orders of gathering everyone are absolute. If she did, Shkanon would have been exposed to her in an instant.

And since from the meta perspective it appears like both Shannon and Kanon are there (thanks Piece Battler), Meta Erika doesn't notice anything is off. The moment she were to reconstruct the scene from Piece Erika's perspective, she would realize that Piece Erika is unaware that she did, in fact, gather everyone, even though "one person is missing".

It's one of the cruelest unreliable narration tricks I've ever seen, but when you put everything together it does add up, which is what I like about it :P
#55 by pendelhaven
2015-09-24 at 03:43
< report >My explanation is a lot simpler. Erika has the Detective's Authority, and is the observer, but whoever said that the observer is not allowed to be --forgetful--? or to miss important details?

In this case, if Erika asks "Is everyone here?" and the liar pieces says "yes" and she herself forgets Shannon's entire character, it still works. Yes its a nasty trick, and is probably a cheap move, but yeah as long as it works.

Or maybe (and this is a long shot) if I read ep5 again, I'd probably find out that Erika --NEVER-- saw Shannon. We as the readers assumed piece Erika knew Shannon when in fact she never saw her/him. Therefore even if there's a red saying she indeed gathered everyone, that's just based on her limited knowledge. The confusion is set, and R07 just have to trick us.Last modified on 2015-09-24 at 19:25
#56 by danpmss
2015-10-02 at 14:47
< report >" The confusion is set, and R07 just have to trick us."

#55
And he do that, quite brilliantly hahahaLast modified on 2015-10-02 at 14:48

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