|#51 by tyr|
2015-05-15 at 16:09
Wait, you're criticizing the VN because the girls fall for the MC for no comprehensible reason? That's like criticizing fast food restaurants for serving fast food. Almost every single VN is like that. It's just how the Shounen stuff works.lolwat? no.
This trope has nothing to do with "Shounen".
And badly written romance is surely not part of the definition of a VN. Just because most VNs are stupid wish fulfillment for lonely selfinserting otakus doesn't mean that it wouldn't be legit to criticize it.
|#52 by adormus|
2015-05-15 at 16:54
|Meh, I quite dislike nitpicking.|
First of all: Cartagra does not target teenagers - I know that very well. I was just pointing out how VNs usually work. It's always 1 guy who gets 'em all. I can't recall any decent VN where this doesn't happen. Although I'd really like to see one. Anyway, you're wrong. Criticizing a single VN over that matter is idiotic. It's the medium's and the audience's fault, since it is expected to be like that. The one legit thing to do is to praise VNs which do a better job about it. Which leads me to the next point.
Second: The romance part in Cartagra is actually way better than your typical "shounen" crap.
You can grasp why they like the MC. Hatsune just doesn't have any other male person to cling to. Most likely it's the missing father figure that drives her towards the MC. Rin is in a semi-relationship with the MC from the start. And Kazuna goes through a lot of crap with him at her side, which really helps to form a bond. He's also a "bad guy" and former police officer. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that's quite a bit better than your typical generic high school setting, where the plain glasses protag gets the school beauty, his sister and the loli principal at the same time.
Lastly: It's kinda lame to condem most VN readers just because you don't share their tastes.
|#53 by tyr|
2015-05-15 at 17:19
|I thiink your definition of "shounen" is a bit off, but that doesn't really matter in this discussion here.|
It's always 1 guy who gets 'em all. I can't recall any decent VN where this doesn't happen. Although I'd really like to see one. Anyway, you're wrong. Criticizing a single VN over that matter is idiotic.I played hundreds of VNs and I can name many VNs with a good romance story and a plausible relationship between the MC and a girl.
For example, Love Letter is quite like an Innocent Grey game with a bloody and gory murder story in the center. But most of its heroines don't like the MC much more than any other guy. There is no harem, instead you have central love story between the MC and the main heroine which develops in a plausible way throughout the game.
I kinda understand your arguments, but I want to have much more faith in the medium Visual Novel. Not every VN which has the requirements to be a harem is a harem.
That's why I think it's legit to criticize those popular tropes.
Lastly: I didn't condem anyone. I was just stating a well-known fact. Do you want to say that the target audience for wish-fullfilment VN aren't lonely otakus? Or do you want to say that those vns aren't quite "stupid" considering the plausibility of their stories?
|#54 by adormus|
2015-05-15 at 17:52
|Well, you can correct me if I'm wrong, but I always thought shounen means that the target audience is "teenage boys".|
Anyway, I understand your reasoning behind your first post. But I still think that most VNs are supposed to be "light hearted". My example of choice would be Majikoi. The romance options in Majikoi are ridiculous, to say the least. Not a single one is depicted properly. There's no romance developement at all. Not even with Miyako. But it's still not targeting Otakus who long for "wish fulfillment" as you said. It's just a light hearted comedy with romance options. This is the main theme for most VNs. The way I see it, most readers just don't want any more depth, since depth complicates things. Which directly contradicts the light hearted main theme. It's the same reason why the most successful anime and manga are the most dull and repetitive ones - Dragon Ball, One Piece, Naruto etc. In other words: Fast food entertainment. And while this really is a sad thing, it'd be even worse if you were right. But I don't think you are.
Everyone who doesn't like that, has to wait for niche products or rare masterpieces. Just like your Love Letter example.
|#55 by bunny1ov3r|
2015-05-15 at 18:11
yes takoyaki guy is definitely a plus. I don't even know why :D
Thanks for the fast response.
Well, maybe girls falling for the main guy for no reason is an overstatement. My main point is that there are a lot of routes in a relatively short span of story time, with many routes having a huge portion of similar story ( I am talking about the first 3 or 4). Most of the routes have relationship development that is really rushed. And it does distract from the central mystery. But yes, nobody compels you to play all the route, which just brings me to my other main point that the protagonist is really weak and unmemorable, not likeable to me anyways. You'd expect an ex-detective and soldier to be at least capable of holding a brawl and deduce with more prowess.
Thanks for defending my right to make some negative pointsLast modified on 2015-05-15 at 18:14
|#56 by yuusha-98|
2016-04-09 at 19:29
|Can someone tell me when the action of Cartagra occures? I just want to know when it starts, not be spoiled from when to when it takes place.|
|#57 by bunny1ov3r|
2016-04-09 at 20:26
|Action? Never in my opinion.|
The mystery start at the very beginning. It seems really slow because the plot is bogged down by everyday life interactions. it does get exciting toward the end.
|#58 by yuusha-98|
2016-04-09 at 20:46
|It seems I was misunderstood. I was talking about the time of the action/Cartagra. Have we a specific date when we start reading? If not, a month? Something like that.|
|#59 by vorathiel|
2016-04-09 at 21:25
|I went to youtube wrote 'cartagra part 1' and found it. After 16 minutes of game you get your first date, first day of 'investigation', 6th day of February. Without the year.|
|#60 by yuusha-98|
2016-04-09 at 21:43
|I am not lazy, I wanted the date without having to play it or search in those bushes full of thornes. But thank you.|
|#61 by 420yoloswag|
2016-04-12 at 00:38
|Just finished, and wow the ending was so crazy! The plot was progressing so smoothly and suddenly plunged into madness! Great VN!!|
|#62 by molester|
2017-07-17 at 13:36
|So I have a question about Yura in true end!|
I didn`t play KnS yet, so i don`t know if that`s explained in there.
So Shugo shot Yura to save Kazuna and she`s in coma, in the end Shugo told Kazuna to go overseas for studying, she accepted it and said that she`ll be back so they could live all happily, while Shugo promised to look after Yura and wait for her!
So what happend to Yura after Kazuna returned to Shugo? I know that they get married and Kazuna is pregnant when KnS events started. Is that explained in KnS? Or not?Last modified on 2017-07-17 at 13:37
|#63 by bunny1ov3r|
2017-07-30 at 16:32
|@62, no it is not explained.|
|#64 by jjlinz1|
2017-10-30 at 03:19
|@62: it explained in Nagomibako Innocent Grey fandisc: link|
It have Kazuna End(TRUE END) and Yura End(Happy End)
|#65 by yxacceleratorxy|
2019-01-11 at 16:21
|never mindLast modified on 2019-01-15 at 07:09|
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